January 14 - An interview with Zach and Elsy

Life changes very quickly when you have children, and it's such a dramatic and fast change that you almost don't even recognize the life you had before them. Going along with that, I can't remember what I felt about parenting or how I thought about it before Elliot and Eleanor showed up. All I know is the here and now, living in the middle of it.  I've lost those memories and opinions of how I thought it would be.

Yesterday, I went in a slightly different direction from the interviews that I have done throughout this month.  I'd focused so far on people with children of their own because I wanted to see how people in similar situations (that is, they also had kids) saw things.  But I also wanted to see if I could get back to that place before I had children, to see parenting through eyes that had not been clouded or influenced by the actual experience.  And that lead me to Zach and Elsy.

Zach is Elliot's godfather and has been one of my best friends for many, many years.  Elsy has been a godmother to her cousin’s children for seven years as well.   They both have multiple siblings: Zach has an older brother and two younger sisters, while Elsy has a twin brother and a younger brother.  Both also work in some facet of education (Zach works for a college, while Elsy works for a charter school).  So while they aren’t parents themselves, they have been around children and have had a wealth of experience with them.

How did y'all meet?

Elsy:  We met at a meeting at Wheaton (where they both went to college) for the Intercultural Board. I was treasurer, and he was a representative for the Tree House (Zach's dorm building and one of the loudest places that I have ever tried to sleep in).

He walked in and I said he was cute, and I asked someone who he was. And they said, "You don't know my boy, Zach Hicks?!"

Zach: We said hi, but I has just finished swim practice and I was too busy stuffing my face with rice for anything other than that.  But it just went from there.

What were your parents like?

Elsy: We were just talking about that yesterday. They were and are both hard working people.  My mom wears the pants in the family.  She was strict, and was and is an introvert.  I think she expected me to be the same way.  She expected to be at home right after school, she didn't like me out doing things or having people over.  My dad is quieter, not as head strong.

Zach: My mom has always been the leader of all activities and traditions.  My dad moved around a lot had to grow up very young.  He lived with his brother on their own at 16, and they were basically cut off from the rest of the family.  Because of that he didn't have a lot of traditions. My mom is the one that talks about family lineage and history.

They were both open minded and very liberal, and they obviously passed that along to me.  They instilled values in me, but they were more "go with the flow" when it came to parenting.

What do you want to pass on that you learned from your parents?

Zach: Something we want to pass on is work ethic. Both Elsy’s parents and my parents worked really hard to provide for us and our siblings. Something we think about on almost a daily basis is how hard our parents work(ed) and the grit they have, it’s something that we admire and try to embody/evoke in our lives and work, it’s something that we want our children to have. If you want something in life you have to work for it, you aren’t entitled to anything.

  

What is your funniest childhood memory?

Elsy: When I was learning to ride bike, I think that is one of my funniest memories.  The thing is that I would always pick up on things first.  My (twin) brother was always a step behind, I always took charge of him.  But this time, with riding a bike, he just got it. He just took off.  And I was humbled to my core.

I failed for weeks at it, until finally, I threw my bike on the ground and yelled at it. "Listen, Bike! You better let me ride you or I will never ride a bike ever!" And the crazy thing is that right after that, I could ride it. 

Zach: My mom does this thing called "body band."  She would tickle me and play an instrument on me (I do the same thing with Elliot, I hold him up like a guitar and "play the Elliot").  She also does this thing called "thigh bees."  I'm super ticklish on my thighs, and she would make this "buzz" sound out of the blue and I knew that meant they were coming.

Are kids in the cards for you two? Why?

Elsy and Zach (in unison): Yes!

Zach: I have a few motivations for having them…I lost my train of thought... wait, there it is! I always wanted a family, one of my own.  I see you with your kids and it looks so exciting and fulfilling.   That desire to have kids has always been there, it’s always a step I wanted to take.  It’s one of those natural steps in life that I want to take.

I think back to having siblings, and that was such a fundamental part of my life. I always wanted a big, big family.

Elsy (laughing): Two, max!

Elsy (to Zach): Did you think you’d have kids by now?

Zach: I never had an age expectation.

Me: And I think that’s great.  If it’s supposed to happen it will happen. I know people who have had children “way too early” and they’re terrific parents.  And I know people that are awful parents and had kids “at the right time.”

Do you think your experience as a teacher has made an impact on you wanting children?

Elsy: Teaching kids that are not your own, it’s not the same as being a parent obviously but it has prepared me in some ways. I’m a lot more patient around little kids than some other people that I know.  I know how to handle them when they’re acting out or fighting, and I know how to praise them and be their cheerleader when they do something right.  But seeing kids every day, I don’t feel this urge to have them right now.  I don’t need to have my own because I have all of these kids at school.  They keep me busy.

It has also let me see that it’s important to say “no.”  I can tell the kids that are used to hearing the word “no” in their lives.  And that doesn’t mean those parents are not cheerleaders or supportive, of course they are.  But I can tell those kids that have had boundaries firmly set, they are easier to handle at school.  The ones where their parents are afraid to say “no,”  the ones that don’t hear “no” at home and push for a “yes,” they are a handful.

What are you looking forward to the most about being a parent? The least?

Zach: The thing(s) I look forward to the most are witnessing the milestones that our kid(s) will have as they grow – their first steps, their first word, learning to ride a bike, learning how to swim, etc. I also look forward to the seemingly small things: making my child laugh, being the person they snuggle up to at night and fall asleep on, being the person they get excited to see when I get home from work – those types of things.

I’m least looking forward to the moments when I’m unable to fix or remedy something, when there is just nothing I can do to make something better. Whether that be when my child is sick and fussy, or the day that my daughter or son gets their heart broken by their first love – obviously I will do everything I can do comfort them but having to let those things run their course is something I imagine will be super uncomfortable and something I don’t look forward to at all.

  

Have you felt any pressure to have kids?

Zach: No, not from my side.

Elsy:  A little yeah. It’s nothing direct, but there are a lot of little comments that are easy to pick up on.  “You’re turning 30, do you have any big plans this decade?” Or, “I just spoke with someone back home and they asked about you and if you were married and if you had kids.  I told them that you were married, but no…no kids.”  Things like that.  No one has said anything outright but they make comments.  But my brother has three kids, so it’s not like there aren’t grandkids around, so that takes some of the pressure off.

If you had a choice, would you be on Team Boy or Team Girl?

Zach: Both, I’d like one of each like you got.

Elsy: Yes, ideally we’d have both.

Zach: I would like the girl first to be honest.  They are always more mature, they develop faster.  And the guys that I know with older sisters seem to be cooler guys.

Elsy: See I disagree.  Most boys I know that have younger sisters stand up for them. I want boy first, because unfortunately in this world we need some protecting sometimes.

Because of their backgrounds, I wanted to get their take on raising children in a country that has such a negative history when it comes to race and gender inequality.  It’s a history that we are still living to this day, which is evident every time you turn on the evening news.

How do you feel about raising kids in the climate that we currently find ourselves?

Elsy: The day after election (of Trump), I cried.  And I told Zach, “I don’t even want to have kids anymore.”  I was afraid and sad, and I kept thinking, “Is it going to be safe?”

Zach: It’s unfortunately always going to be a conversation that will be need to had.  Trump didn’t invent this situation, he’s just made it more present to people that maybe don’t have constant exposure to it (like people of color do).  I just see it as a discussion with kids about race, and framing it as a question of treating people the right way or the wrong way.

Elsy: I don’t know what to tell our kids in the future that this happened, but I think you have to be really transparent about it.  Yes, we are awesome but we also can do bad things.

Is there anything that you’re nervous about?

Elsy: I’m nervous about balance my job.  You might think, “Hey, she’s a teacher, that’s perfect, summers off to be with the kids.”  But it’s not like that.  The type of school I work at is different than normal, and it requires a ton of work outside of normal hours.  The communities I work with have challenges that go above and beyond the norm.  I don’t want my kids to suffer because of it.

Zach:  I’m nervous about balance too, balancing of our relationship with a child, balancing work, balancing our friendships and other relationships.  Right now we are pretty free to go and do what we want when we want. Obviously that will change, but I think the challenge will come in finding the place where we both feel a sense of balance a stability over the choices and sacrifices we make.

We’re lucky though because we do a good job of communicating and knowing that it can’t always be 50/50.  There’s situations where one of us has to cover for the others.  So just learning how to do that will be tough but I think we can handle it. 

Have you ever changed a diaper?

Zach: Ummmm…no.  No, I don’t think that I’ve ever changed one.

Elsy: I’ve changed many diapers.  Starting at 7, my job was changing my little brother’s diapers.  So yes, I’ve changed a lot.

This question lead us to the topic of how gross kids can be, which is always funny to talk about with friends who don’t have kids.  I also find the negatives about parenting to be easier to relate to people without kids.  While they might not have a frame of reference for being spit up on or changing poop filled diapers, they can imagine what that would smell like or feel like.  We’ve all seen gross out comedies, and it’s easy to laugh when hearing the horror stories of parents.  It’s easy to roll your eyes and grumble when you talk about not sleeping, and it’s easy for those without kids to chuckle about that.

I don’t have the vocabulary to accurately describe the joy that being a dad brings me.

It’s that joy that I wish upon couples like Zach and Elsy.  A lot of their fears and nervousness made me remember what I felt like before Elliot and Eleanor arrived in our lives.  We’re all just making this up as we go along, and there are going to be days where we fall short.  And knowing that can be comforting, but it can also be terrifying as well. It’s all just how you face it and what you make of it.  Luckily, that joy is what keeps you going through the dark times and through the doubt.

Zach and Elsy are going to be great parents if they ever have that chance.  If they don’t, I know a little boy and little girl in North Carolina that will grow up with an amazing aunt and uncle.